The Loneliness Pandemic - Part 1

This week, Kelley Richey and Julia Avery delve into the specifics of loneliness, its effects on mental and physical health, Kodokushi, and the importance of community. This episode is Part 1 of 2 episodes that addresses the current loneliness pandemic and the health risks associated. Part 2 will be focused on identifying creative solutions.

Quarantine's Impact On Community

Before the pandemic, what was the true quality of our social interactions? It appeared as though society was adopting the homebody and binge culture. However, after being instructed to stay at home to prevent spreading the virus, suddenly everyone seemed to crave social interactions and to be outdoors. In a way, social distancing was kind of a thing before this pandemic. Hopefully, quarantining has made most of us realize how important our relationships and other people’s involvement in our lives are. 

Loneliness and Its Effects on Mental Health

"Human beings are social creatures. Our connection to others enables us to survive and thrive.” According to The National Institute on Aging, “Social isolation and loneliness do not always go together. About 28 percent of older adults in the United States, or 13.8 million people, live alone, according to a report by the Administration for Community Living’s Administration on Aging of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, but many of them are not lonely or socially isolated. At the same time, some people feel lonely despite being surrounded by family and friends.”

To be more specific, social isolation is the physical objective separation from other people while loneliness is the distressed feeling of being alone and separated.

Health Risks Associated with Loneliness

Research from The Cacioppo Evolutionary Theory of Loneliness predicts that “loneliness automatically triggers a set of related behavioral and biological processes that contribute to the association between loneliness and premature death in people of all ages.”
According to Steve Cole, Ph.D.’s research, the feeling of chronic loneliness causes the individual to feel threatened and distrustful of others which activates a biological defense mechanism. Losing a sense of community changes a person’s perspective of the world.
“Loneliness is an important worldwide public health concern affecting people of all cultures and ages, with prevalence rates predicted increase to “epidemic”levels in the future (Gerst-Emerson and Jayawardhana 2015).”

Researchers found that loneliness increased mortality by 26%. The effects of loneliness are linked to smoking, obesity, elevated blood pressure, heart disease, increased hypothalamic pituitary adrenocortical activity, adverse effects on cognitive performance, the progression of Alzheimer’s disease, diminished executive functioning, and impaired sleep. Loneliness also has serious consequences for mental health and well-being, consistently emerging as a significant risk factor for depression, suicidal ideation and behavior. In addition, it has been associated with  alcoholism and alcohol abuse.

Kodokushi and Japan's Battle with Loneliness
The Impact of Loneliness on Older People
How Technology Can Solve the Problem of Loneliness
Depictions of Loneliness in Movies
The Mental Health Stigma in America

Transcript

Julia Avery : 0:17

Hi, welcome to family ties. This is Julia Avery. And here's my co host and sister

Kelley Richey : 0:25

Kelly. Hi everybody. We're back. Yeah.

Julia Avery : 0:31

So today we are doing a two parter episode on the same topic. It's just so layered that we want to be able to spend enough time on it to really delve into some of the different points. So today we're going to be kind of walking through the issue and then part two will be kind of going over our ideas for solutions, etc. So before we begin, just wanted to address the current public bid prices want to thank those who are on the front lines for putting themselves out there for a greater cause and themselves and their families at risk. In addition to all of the families, Kelly and I both want to extend our sympathies to anyone who has been affected by this or knows anyone that has either caught it or passed because of it. We just want to let you know that everyone's thoughts and wishes to do.

Kelley Richey : 1:27

Yeah, absolutely. It's just one of those things where this is the weirdest thing I've ever lived through in my life. You know, it's not weird just to think about how this will be in the history books someday. And we're going to look back with even more shame than we feel now with how we've dealt with this.

Unknown Speaker : 1:44

Yeah. So in our lifetime, Kelly, we've dealt with more. You dealt with a terrorist attack. We've dealt with a pandemic.

Unknown Speaker : 1:54

We've dealt with a housing crisis.

Kelley Richey : 1:57

Yep. And guess what, next up, maybe Your

Unknown Speaker : 2:02

aliens.

Unknown Speaker : 2:05

tendency. I don't know about that. But

Unknown Speaker : 2:10

really?

Kelley Richey : 2:12

Are you an alien person? Wow. Not like an actual alien, but like an alien believer.

Unknown Speaker : 2:17

Oh, I saw I don't believe in the little green men, but I do believe that there's other life out there.

Kelley Richey : 2:22

Okay, well speaking of life out there, let's talk more about this pandemic.

Unknown Speaker : 2:28

So yeah, our topic today is kind of along the lines of the effects of isolation and everybody quarantining and the effects of how that has an impact on people's social lives, not just now, but the way we handle our social lives in general. And this is just further emphasizing that, so to speak. Yeah. Before we begin, though, I wanted to let everybody know to go visit our website with all the information on it, just in case you can make it to the end of the episode with a one size ration. I'm gonna shout it out in the beginning every time.

Kelley Richey : 3:06

Julia they're gonna listen to every last second, every last straw. Okay?

Unknown Speaker : 3:12

I hope so.

Unknown Speaker : 3:15

You can, you can visit our website, www dot the family ties podcast calm. It has links to all of our social platforms. It's got posts, it's got blogs and information about Kelly and myself. So if you're interested in knowing more about us, go check it out and join the family

Kelley Richey : 3:36

guests join the family. So Julia, you have been quarantined? Like pretty hardcore. Yes. So you feel this really acutely, but like for me, I'm still working my work the brewery is considered a essential, you know, because people still gotta drink especially during times of trouble. So I've been pretty busy at work and the one thing I am noticing thing is that even with that, like I'm going to work on just coming home. And I've been dealing a lot with loneliness. And I think that's why we wanted to talk about it today is because this exacerbates that. And for those of us like me who have anxiety and depression, those things really kick into high gear when you have like a feeling of isolation. So that's what we're going to get into today with some actual science. So this is going to count as our science and psychology episode. So we kind of keep combining topics, it's just going to happen, but this is going to be it's going to sound more psychological, but there is real science to back up these numbers. So

Unknown Speaker : 4:38

Ellie, why don't you give us some of these facts and percentages and numbers and data? Well, before we do that,

Kelley Richey : 4:44

let's just give a shout out to those people who have to be all alone, like one person living in a house by themselves in their quarantined. Imagine that because I have three roommates, and we've got dogs and that has helped a lot lot, but even at that point, you know, with me having people here, I would have thought at this point in the pandemic, me and my roommates who we all get along really, really well that we would have started like, Oh, you know, a book club or a movie night or everybody share a meal together. But we've kind of ended up being more than seeing just as much isolation where people are just kind of doing things in their rooms, closed doors, not what I thought the possibilities could be. So it's really been hitting me hard because I'm a very social creature. And it's difficult for me because I just, I like sharing time and meals and just little moments because we grew up in a big family, like I'm used to being surrounded by people. I was like, Okay, so this is affecting me. Community is vital for my emotional well being, how does this translate into the real world and I looked at this article, it's called social isolation. Loneliness in older people pose health risks. So there are actual health risks that go along with being isolated and lonely. And this just starts by Just saying that human beings are social creatures, our connection to others enables us to survive and thrive yet as we age, many of us are alone more often than when we were younger, leaving us vulnerable to social isolation and loneliness and related health problems such as cognitive decline, depression, and heart disease. So fortunately, there are ways to counteract these negative effects. And so this first episode is going to be about us talking about the negative effects and the science and then the second part will be us kind of giving you some ideas and solutions to tackle that. Yeah. Right. So I think you know, in relation to that community, you know, is vital, not just for my well being, but it says for everyone's the National Institute on Aging continues with a quote, social isolation and loneliness don't always go together. About 20% of older adults in the US live alone, but many of them are not lonely or socially isolated, but at the same time, some people feel lonely despite being surrounded by family and friends. And that goes to show that research has linked social isolation and loneliness to higher risks for a variety of physical and mental conditions like high blood pressure, heart disease, obesity, a weakened immune system with anxiety, depression, cognitive decline, Alzheimer's, and even death. That's crazy. Just from loneliness,

Unknown Speaker : 7:20

you hit on an interesting point that you can be surrounded by people, but still feel lonely. And what's really driving that. So we might be surrounded by people that I feel like the emphasis really is on the way our relationships are formed, and how do we keep them up? How are we interacting with each other? Are we just sitting around the table on our phones and around people technically but feeling lonely? Or are we actively participating in activities with each other helping each other and still feeling lonely? What what are the activities that really surround these social interactions?

Kelley Richey : 7:56

You hit the nail on the head there with the the technology part like what role has technology began to play in how we are handling this. And of course, it's great in some regards, you know, we have all this Netflix to binge watch things and to kind of remain distracted but people who are staying home with their children and families or is everybody just still sitting in their rooms,

Unknown Speaker : 8:18

Doors closing his people were doing this before the pandemic. I've told you this before Kelly, I feel like social distancing was a thing before.

Kelley Richey : 8:29

It really was people just didn't realize it. Yeah. But you know what, what really causes people to do the opposite of what they're doing is if someone in authority tells them, they can't do something, then all of a sudden, that's all they want to do. All they want to do is be outside. They're like stand doors, and then all of a sudden you just look out and there's like bikers, there's families, there's like people everywhere and I'm like what took it took people advising you to stay home for you to actually go outside and leave your house. Okay. Psychology guys that's

Unknown Speaker : 9:03

supposed to go when you're not supposed to do something, your instinct is to do it. And you and I both have talked about this before we have that problem with authority.

Kelley Richey : 9:12

Definitely. Oh, and it's, I mean, the reason I've been seeing all these people outside is

Unknown Speaker : 9:16

going out on my bike. I mean, I have not been 100% quarantined, I still have to make money somehow. So there's some nights where I'll go out and do Uber delivery, food delivery, where my mask and I work love so hence hand sanitizer right now, and I couldn't find any more

Unknown Speaker : 9:38

shoppers.

Unknown Speaker : 9:42

Anyway, so I've gone out a little bit, but I'm not going out and trying to like gather with groups of friends. I'm not trying to party

Kelley Richey : 9:50

well, and just to kind of clarify for everybody. I feel like the main goal of this particular double parter is to kind of give you a sense of Yes, what we're dealing with now. Now, but also provide encouragement and facts and ideas for how to deal with it now and also how to go forward in the future and learn to be more connected with others because it is so key and vital. And in this day and age where technology does roll, I think we all kind of need a reminder and this has kind of been the one blessing with this pandemic is that I think it's starting to make us realize that our interactions with others are more necessary than we thought before.

Unknown Speaker : 10:28

Exactly. Now we're craving it.

Kelley Richey : 10:31

So the doctor who I quoted from that article, his research found that being alone and loneliness are different but related, like we talked about social isolation is the objective physical separation from other people living alone, while loneliness is this subjective, distressed feeling of being alone or separated and that's where I'm at. It's possible to feel lonely while among other people and you can be alone yet not feel lonely. We discussed that and I think it's It's definitely something I didn't think I'd feel and I do if I didn't have Thomas my boyfriend, then I would be truly in the pit of despair.

Unknown Speaker : 11:07

Thank you, Thomas.

Kelley Richey : 11:10

Thank you, Thomas. He's such a babe. The cat, let's see if I can say this right the catchy yopo evolutionary theory of loneliness is that loneliness automatically triggers a set of related behavioral and biological processes that contribute to the association between loneliness and premature death and people of all ages. So not just old people, but everyone.

Unknown Speaker : 11:33

So losing a sense of connection and community changes a person's perception of the world, someone experiencing chronic loneliness feels threatened and mistrustful of others, which activates a biological defense mechanism says Dr. Ph. D. Steve Cole, I think is extremely important. And that's another point that brings up the health problems that are become a result of this kind of thing and it's triggered by mental illness as well. Because it's all physical. So it's in our minds. It's all mental, but we need to discuss how that mental aspect starts to affect the physical body and physically manifesting itself. Yeah, it's all a chemical makeup so the more your suppressed, lonely and start to become depressed, that triggers chemical levels in your body that start to affect your health, your well being like whether it be cortisol levels for stress that start to trigger and offset other important chemicals that maybe throw off serotonin etc. Like a domino effect. It starts really impacting everything else, and it only gets worse you don't do anything or take steps to correct that problem, then it can lead to further health problems.

Kelley Richey : 12:54

Well, Julie, you're not even a doctor and you hit the nail on the head there because Dr. Cole also says the biology of loneliness can accelerate the buildup of plaque and arteries help cancer cells grow and spread and promote inflammation in the brain leading to Alzheimer's. Loneliness promotes several different types of wear and tear on the body. People who feel lonely may also have weakened immune cells, which is Bad News Bears right now that have trouble fighting off viruses which makes them more vulnerable to some infectious diseases. So

Unknown Speaker : 13:26

that's a scary that's kind of that's a scary thought right now, being quarantine and getting lonely could make you more susceptible to the virus if presented with it.

Kelley Richey : 13:37

Yeah, in addition to having facetiming with your family and friends, or you know, just calling or texting, I would suggest more of a face to face like a facetiming because it makes it feel a little bit more personal. You will tend to talk a little bit longer, have more meaningful conversations. And speaking of that, we're going to be having a think all five of us girls are going to be talking All together on Saturday to celebrate Janet's birthday on WhatsApp, since she's in Germany, we take any moment that we can at this point, and I haven't heard from her in forever, and it's good to have those moments to really be thankful for what we have. And for those who are in our lives, they also this article also suggests that, quote, working for a social cause or purpose with others who share your values in our trusted partners, puts you in contact with others and helps develop a greater sense of community that we can't do right now. So just write that down in your book for things to get back to once things are back to normal, but that's just one thing. And then I also found this other really interesting thing. It's a on research gate website, loneliness, it's correlations in associations with health behaviors and outcomes. They're always really long titles for scientific articles. It's like wow, is this a story in itself? Cool. It says there is an association between feeling lonely and alcohol consumption hazardous drinking and smoking and poor health working for the alcohol industry. It is not slowing down though revving up I think it's just one of those things where that in the recreational marijuana those are just like essential essential for most people because they've their coping mechanisms

Unknown Speaker : 15:19

in it and it makes sense why people back on that because if they aren't able to change their situation, it's kind of hopeless and chemical dependencies can help deal them for yourself

Kelley Richey : 15:30

relying on Oh, do you know what I'm depending on Julia right now? Yes, but sugar, sugar specifically. So I'm working on that because I'm realizing just how much of an emotional tie I have to that. And so eating can be throwing in here as well. All this affecting like, bored. I'm just like, what am I going to do? I might as well have a snack. Yeah. Am I hungry? Nope. But I need a sign that you're not on social media right now. Kelly and that's great. I wish to do the same but My gosh, it's so wonderful. I was thinking about that earlier, I will have made videos

Unknown Speaker : 16:05

of themselves, you know, or jokes about constantly eating throughout the day. And there's this one guy, my favorite is actually this guy who wanted the frigerator with his blanket like a cape this he's just like trash into the fridge, put something out and then walked back down the hall and he disappeared down the hall. And then the next time he came out, it was like he had wrapped it up to look like this dress, and it was all tucked to look like a dress and he was like doing this fashion look to the fridge. Then he'd stopped pose, go to the fridge, get something else go back. And then he'd come out and he'd have fixed the blanket a different way. And it was all like this fashion show like constantly going back and forth to the fridge.

Unknown Speaker : 16:47

Yeah, you're right though. Sorry, side.

Unknown Speaker : 16:51

sidetrack there. Hey Julia bridge. That story was great

Unknown Speaker : 16:57

for making videos of ourselves,

Kelley Richey : 17:00

And guess what? That still didn't make me when they get back on social

Unknown Speaker : 17:03

media. Yeah, that wasn't the goal. So okay, okay, I know that was just I was just clarifying I was just trying to flesh no other people are posting about this so your point about the bulk eating is definitely a real

Kelley Richey : 17:20

I'm gonna have to stop buying sugar stuff like candy and sugar and then I'll be really sad.

Unknown Speaker : 17:27

I know there should be a rehab facility for sugar addiction

Kelley Richey : 17:32

that no shit Julia because I would go to that in a heartbeat. Like I just need someone to just tell me no like I can't tell myself now so I just need someone to like

Unknown Speaker : 17:42

yes needs to be in a rehab facility where you can't leave the food is provided to you. You cannot leave to go secretly buy candy even while everyone's no vending

Kelley Richey : 17:55

machines here.

Unknown Speaker : 17:56

I am definitely guilty of Meeting.

Unknown Speaker : 18:02

Well, oh man, well, let's,

Kelley Richey : 18:04

let's talk about something both sad, tragically sad. And then something that's the optimistic side of it. There's this other article I found that is my favorite one of the ones that I kind of read through on this topic. It was on huffpost. And it's called, I don't know what the title is. I forgot I didn't write it down. But it discusses when I quote how loneliness is a big issue in the country of 127 million, which has the oldest population in the world, Japan by 2024 40% of Japan's inhabitants will be so low dwellers, because, you know, they their life expectancy is the highest in the world, and they end up finding themselves alone, you know, these really old ages. So the consequences of this has been a rise in Kuta Koshi people dying alone and remaining undiscovered for long periods of time. There is an estimated and I'm still quoting guys, I'm sorry. I should be better about letting you know when I'm starting to quote but they say that there's an estimated 30,000 of these lonely deaths per year. But companies that clean apartments when CUDA coaches are discovered, say the number could be two to three times higher business. Yeah, just imagine you had a family some some of them, you know, have kids and families and this is just how it ends up being. But this social phenomenon, and I'm quoting again, is a public health risk and concern linked to depression, dementia and heart disease businesses see an opportunity to help through technology. Enter robots, seal companions, this is where it gets good guys, so don't be Don't be too sad for too long. Pero I know I'm so sorry. Pero robotic seal at Tokyo silver winged care facility, aimed at providing residents with therapy and social interactions is something that they're using to kind of reach these people. So residents talk to the seals About everyday events such as the weather, and then it serves the little seals serve as a starting point for conversations between residents. I love that. And there's such cute pictures of these seals sitting on tables, these little bitty furry like stuffed seals, and I just think technology can play a good and bad role. Yeah, and here's where technology is helping.

Unknown Speaker : 20:22

I do wish that it could be real human interaction, but it is really sweet the same time. I just wish we didn't have to resort to technology.

Kelley Richey : 20:32

Thomas and I had this discussion where in the future you're going to be able to actually I'm using air quotes that you can't see it guys take a vacation somewhere or you know, go walking the streets of Venice or something

Unknown Speaker : 20:42

you can see on the Black Mirror show and

Kelley Richey : 20:46

yeah, I would rather do it in person, myself. A personal physical experience. Even if it's less dreamy than what you get in that kind of virtual

Unknown Speaker : 20:57

world. I wouldn't enjoy it as much Just because I knew it wasn't real, it just started I already have set it up in my brain not to accept it and not to enjoy it as a reality.

Kelley Richey : 21:08

It's not the same. I mean, in the future, it will be more realistic to where, you know, it's kind of tricking your brain into thinking that you're actually there. But I don't know, like, I'm gonna, I'm not super well versed on this,

Unknown Speaker : 21:20

touch, see and hear real stuff.

Kelley Richey : 21:23

Yeah. So I'm going to be one of those people who doesn't deal with all this increasing technology very well. I'm so old school taking my enneagram test, guys, you need to take it. It's amazing. It's a scientific research that breaks down your answers into telling you if you're more of a achiever and enthusiast I'm the helper so for me communication and friendships and people focusing on others is what brings me joy and happiness. And so in a time like this, like all I want to do is I want to play a game. I want to have fixed dinner for people or Share like just a conversation or I don't know. It's been great though because Julia this has forced me to actually be outside more. So Thomas and I were taking a walk week before last. And this is really good news guys to me. I'm pretty excited

Unknown Speaker : 22:15

to say, Oh, do you

Kelley Richey : 22:18

know this will give you some time to think about your Hooray, Julia. So Thomas, I wish we took this long walk and I think we spent a good hour talking about this subject of loneliness and the science behind it and he had some other really interesting things to say, which I've forgotten now because I can't keep anything in my head for very long but I was just telling him how much I felt isolated and I just like my friend and B is gone right now she's out of the state with family and so we're not talking as much because she's busy with her family. I think probably unplugging a bit so it's hard for me to feel this isolated and I and we walked back to the house and we were almost at my yard and I saw my neighbor out in her yard she was heading out the door with her dog for Walk. And so I stopped and I kind of chatted with her for a second and come to find out. I mean, we were standing in our own yards kind of talking 12 feet away from each other. But I found out that she was also raised in a very, very kind of cultish Lee right wing upbringing like I was. And you know, there were a lot I think there were five kids in her family. So right off the bat, we were suddenly we were finding out all these things about each other, how we both suffer from anxiety and depression and, and loneliness and how this is really difficult for us during this time, and she was so cool. And we exchanged numbers, and we've kind of messaged back and forth and we have both left little packages on each other's doorsteps. Like, I left her some beer and some candy and she left us little snacks and things but she is

Unknown Speaker : 23:52

so nice.

Kelley Richey : 23:54

Yes, she said she was going to target and asked if we needed something and I just told her I couldn't find those swings. Wet pads anywhere? And she's like, Oh yeah, I'll look, she went to three stores to try and find those pads for me, I did not know until afterwards. But she brought some of her own and left them on the door. And I was like, This is what I've been missing. It took this moment in time in this pandemic, to really make a good connection with somebody. That's

Unknown Speaker : 24:19

crazy. And I think that she was right next door the entire time is just time. Sure. But What's your hurry? My hurry is I so I always felt alone. Even with friends and family. I've always had a problem with feeling like I'm lovable. I have serious insecurities. And those drive me to have doubt in my support system doubt and whether friends or family really loved me, and that's a problem I'm doing today, but right now, I have proof that I have a support system that really does care about me. I've had like huge Keep up and your huge support emotionally even though it can't be together physically. Then there's also Heather and Kevin, who often are home and are hoping me just kind of rebuild my life. I was getting really depressed with my job. And it was making me again mentally and physically worse, like I have been on a decline for years, this job seriously stress inducing, and it doesn't impact everybody the same because some people thrive off of that kind of environment. But it was such a toxic work environment, and I did not cry. I did not thrive there. I did a great job at what I did. I I wasn't leaving because I was bad at my job I was leaving because the environment I could not I cannot walk in and work with those people work for those managers anymore in the conditions over there. And in order to do that I wasn't financially able to really carry it out on my own. And that's always been the kicker. is being financially capable of making those changes myself. And so I've had a lot of support in this move Heather and Kevin have let me stay with them so I can restart my life and that was proved to me that Okay, I'm going to take people up on their offer to help and it's really hard to do. But now that I've done it, it's proved to me that I really do love me and it's huge.

Kelley Richey : 26:26

That is huge. And I I'm really envious because I remember spending Christmas Heather's and how we all were so unplugged like days at a time. We just sat there and we did puzzles and played games together and just talked and focused on each other. I think we watched like one thing on TV the whole time.

Unknown Speaker : 26:45

Yeah, we didn't even sit down for the entire thing. It's like that Christmas movie, The Scrooge. The Christmas care.

Kelley Richey : 26:52

Yeah, that classic that everybody knows about.

Unknown Speaker : 26:55

Yeah, one that I couldn't make. Yeah, that one. We did. Don't even finish it together. That's how Yeah, yeah. And I think it's good to have people around you that support system, especially when you deal with depression the way Julian I do. I think it's something that as Americans, we're not as in tuned with being accepting and accepting mental health as being as important as our physical outward health fitness and it's one in the same. And there's still stigma around it. They're like companies due to like HR reasons, have medical plans put in place. So if you are dealing with it, you can go to HR, you can get that support, and not necessarily just like, lose your job because of it. But there's still the stigma where it's almost like people still don't believe it. If they haven't personally don't let it or have that issue themselves. It's hard for them to believe that it's real. And it's like, it seems like it's just a problem person and they wish they could fire them. So it's still a stigma. Yes, we have have things in place now to kind of help with it, the stigma is definitely still there. It's true. I think

Kelley Richey : 28:05

it's just one of these things where it took us having a mentally ill mother who was abusive, emotionally and physically when you just have to kind of realize like, you know, I could end up like this but I also want to make sure I don't in taking it seriously and kind of taking account and putting as much money and effort into our minds and the health of our minds is so vitally important. Sorry, I'm flipping through this book. I sound distracted Julia, but I've read this book guys called the little book of Luca, by Mike Viking, the guy who wrote the little book, I believe the W's with a V Viking.

Unknown Speaker : 28:48

Named Luca.

Kelley Richey : 28:49

Yeah, it's in small print who

Unknown Speaker : 28:52

got Luca.

Kelley Richey : 28:53

Yeah, and Luca stands for happiness. The Secret said like

Unknown Speaker : 28:59

that's okay. Of course you would. That's awesome. You wouldn't have thought

Unknown Speaker : 29:03

it was Yeah,

Kelley Richey : 29:05

I would didn't either. I just looked at the pronunciation below. I didn't make that up myself. But so what you were I'm flipping through this because there's some something about depression that I really wanted to mention. But I came across this one thing. This is happiness tip create bonus grandparents. So we all like what Julia was talking about when we were discussing Japan and the old people is that adopted grandparent type of thing. So it says we all benefit from relationships across generational divides, consider who might make good bonus grandparents or just a senior buddy for you just talking about how important it is to kind of give them a sense of family and purpose. If they

Unknown Speaker : 29:47

get you kind of get discarded.

Kelley Richey : 29:50

Yeah, exactly. And that's a big Spear of mine.

Unknown Speaker : 29:54

Yeah. Have you thought about that? Oh, yeah. Huge. And it's partly why like I've always romanticized The idea of not living long of dying young and not having to ever deal with aging or being an author, because it does scare me. And for instance, we've got our grandparents that I'd like to see. And they have been on a decline for a while. And as I know that there's a lot of back and forth between their kids, you know, our dad and his siblings on what to do with them. And that is just some of the callousness that I've heard, you know, trickled down through, you know, through dad and his experience on the calls, just the divide between the siblings on what to do it's like terrifying. I don't he doesn't go into like who says what? So I have no idea which one is trying to but but it's still like, I know that there are some that are like nursing home there are some that are like at home care, let them die in the home that they had built. To let them be with people and then there's some that just seems callous, and it's hard for me to imagine being so out of it that I can't even decide what happens to me and my kids are arguing over whether I get taken to a fucking nursing home or what is terrified.

Kelley Richey : 31:20

That's a totally different subject. I'd like us to cover at some point about just how terrible our nation's programs are for the elderly and just how much money it costs. Just an average person like I couldn't take care of either of my parents with my finances. So just kind of putting it in that perspective of why we are falling so short for not just the older generation, but even for prenatal care and all pretty much everything health related. We just suck guys

Unknown Speaker : 31:50

up for our global issues.

Unknown Speaker : 31:53

Yeah, yeah,

Kelley Richey : 31:56

keep Stay tuned guys, but I found what I was looking for. Page 154 he says depression is a disease but it is treatable. Sadly there is a lot of social stigma around mental illness in South Korea is one of the main things he's kind of referencing in this particular section, as in many other countries, which results in a lack of treatment, sometimes with disastrous consequences. So out of 20 the 28 Oh, ECD countries don't really know what that is guys sorry. But South Korea ranks 27th when it comes to the consumption of antidepressants, Denmark ranks seventh. Does this mean that Danes are more depressed than Koreans? No, it just means they're getting some sort of treatment, whether medication is the right sort of treatment is up for discussion, but it's a good thing to be a society in which treatment for mental illness is available and affordable, subsidized by the government in which the stigma around mental illness has been reduced sufficiently that people feel able to seek treatment. We grew up in a household where mental health was completely ignored like a figment of your imagination.

Unknown Speaker : 32:59

Yeah, and It's still kind of handled that way when I've brought up some of my issues too, like that. He'll, he'll be like, so really think about that. And I'm like, and then and then it becomes like a spiritual thing that you know your mind is at unrest because you're not spiritually in tune anymore or you falling out spiritually. And that is the reason why you have an imbalance and it's like, Huh, no science medicine

Kelley Richey : 33:31

so that I don't sidetrack this conversation completely. I'm gonna just sidestep around that one, even though it really really upsets me and like gets really in it. Yeah, because I mean, guys, we can't overstate enough that our our whole upbringing was so fucked. It is amazing that we have an original thought in our heads, whether it be right or wrong. I mean, we don't claim to have any answers, but I think it's important to Be open about her health. And just like he said, the Danes are seventh in the world for consumption of antidepressants. I don't, I need to look into see where the US lies. But I think he mentioned at some point in the book, it is a must read, it will totally, totally shift your perspective on what's important, and what the role of happiness is to everyone and how important that is just for so many things. I think off the top of my head, I can think of trusting others relationships, even money or relationship with money and how that affects happiness. We'll discuss that next time learning from people who kind of don't necessarily have it all figured out, but are the happiest country in the world consistently on a regular basis, measurable basis. This guy who is the CEO of the happiness Research Institute, he knows a thing or two about happiness. And

Unknown Speaker : 34:53

isn't that amazing?

Kelley Richey : 34:54

It does. It is. Yes, I think it's important for us to kind of reevaluate A lot. But Julia movies, you pick a movie, I pick a movie, where we feel like it really encapsulates loneliness and why we feel that it's important today. And you can start because you had a really great one.

Unknown Speaker : 35:15

So, my movie pick is Ad Astra, the more recent film with Brad Pitt, where he's in space, and he ends up meeting with his father and they both come to terms where he really comes to terms with how his isolation and the loneliness is pushing other people away. And just the movies beautiful and really, you you feel lonely with him as he's Yeah, space like you.

Kelley Richey : 35:44

You feel it somebody who's been trained to suppress their feelings to the degree that he has, you know, you think okay, this of anybody this guy's got it, like he's in a situation where he is completely just alone, and it's out of his control, and just suddenly, the memories that start flooding back to him and him. I think it's also about him rediscovering his humanity. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker : 36:11

And sometimes those bigger situations kind of push that out of you. And once you condition yourself for so long to suppress those feelings and try to ignore the problem, you become a ticking time bomb at some point, you come to that turning point like he did. Or you're like, wow. And something has to change something. Something's gonna

Kelley Richey : 36:33

kind of like if I'm ever lucky enough to see another human being again, I will tell them I've loved them.

Unknown Speaker : 36:39

You know what I mean? Yes.

Kelley Richey : 36:41

So it's not to make you guys feel even more lonely. But I think it's so important that we realize just how important each and every person in our lives are. And I also think it's a great example of this father who was seen as some kind of and I'm not going to ruin anything but seen as Some kind of hero, it sets this tone for Brad Pitt, where he's like, I have to be exceptional. And his whole goal became to be perfect and exceptional and good at what he does. And sure he may be good at it. But I don't really know to what extent his character actually loves what he does. But it causes him to miss out on life around him like real life. So I think it's also a cautionary tale about how we as Americans approach our careers and our parents kind of pushing us to be exceptional.

Unknown Speaker : 37:33

Yeah, and tack on to that is movies Help Help me realize that my problems aren't just my problems, and they're not the worst problems out there. That's something I love about movies that helps me see outside of myself. And the nice thing about this is that even though the topic is loneliness, you're not the only one. So many people deal with loneliness and not just loneliness, but any other mental hindrance. Support mental issue that that really changes or has an effect on your quality of life. You're not alone. I think it's important to watch things that are difficult to see and sit and watch because it's helpful to see outside of yourself and also know that you're not the only one

Kelley Richey : 38:16

dealing with it. Can I also make just this is a stab in the dark. This is like my own interpretation. So I also feel like this is that that movie is like a good statement for how in the past, we've approached male masculinity and how you're supposed to suppress your feelings, you're supposed to become more of a robot and it just kind of shows how not only does that impact your relationships with other people, it impacts your emotional well being your mental health and we're not meant to be robots man or woman and we are meant to be interacting with each other in a healthy manner. And if you just are kind of taught to shut it all down, it's going to explode like you said, it's going to come to the surface in some manner. Other and it's going to be destructive. It's never going to reveal itself in a positive way.

Unknown Speaker : 39:04

So what was your?

Kelley Richey : 39:06

Oh, it was Blade Runner 2049 did Is it 2040 or 2049 Oh God, guys, I'm so sorry.

Unknown Speaker : 39:15

It's the new way sounds like I mean trying to recall something and tell somebody about something I've just seen or whatever and I forget all the important things and they're like good story. I have no idea ice job

Kelley Richey : 39:27

jelly. Well, nice job Kelly on this one. It's Ryan Gosling is my favorite. I'm gonna call him this is like just something I made up my favorite Silent Movie Actor. Oh, I feel like he doesn't have to say a word. You could go through 30 minutes of no dialogue with that guy be

Unknown Speaker : 39:49

Dr is a great example.

Kelley Richey : 39:51

Yeah, him and Carey Mulligan. All you have to do is have a tight shot on their faces as all the that I need. I've never seen The ability to, to this extent to tell a story without words, but with Blade Runner, I don't know if you've seen the first one. It's to me it's also a lot about loneliness and the human condition. But this one specifically, I think, is a great representative of sets sci fi, so you know, you're talking about virtual reality, you're talking about him. Here's the thing he I think I don't want to ruin anything. So let's just pretend I don't know what happens. There's a possibility that his character could be a replicant, which if you've seen the originals, you know what that means. But he's out there, you know, having to get rid of the other replicates. So kind of like with Harrison Ford's character in the original, he's meant to take out certain replicates that are still out there. There you look just like humans act just like humans, but they're, they're not there. They're these robotic kind of manifestations. But he learned throughout the movie that there is humanity in them and they're really rich, rich in in their feelings and then we kind of have the caveat towards the end like his head. Harrison Ford, a replicant to also

Unknown Speaker : 41:02

shocker, twin, whoo.

Kelley Richey : 41:07

But with Ryan Gosling, you know, he's pretty much just a machine working, but we're also still seeing that he has these feelings of loneliness. He's got this virtual reality girl and how much he relies upon that and how just how sad and lonely he is like, he doesn't even seem to really fully realize the extent of his isolation in like a very modern, futuristic world where everything tends to separate people from people more and more and more and more you

Unknown Speaker : 41:35

think that do you think you kind of agree with me where a lot of people more people than even think deal with issues that should be treated, who don't even think they have an issue who honestly don't acknowledge or believe it or and it's just been something they've dealt with for all her life, and it's just a thing and they don't think of it as a real condition to get treated.

Kelley Richey : 41:59

I think that's the whole point that this guy Mike in this book is making about just because some people, someone countries, using more antidepressants doesn't mean that this country is like 29th doesn't have as much problems as them, it just means that they're less comfortable detailing it and going to someone for help, because it took me almost a whole lifetime to realize that it was okay to realize like, I mean, I spent a good 12 years like so involved in someone else's depression that I didn't realize how miserable in my head that I was seeing anxiety. Like, if someone 15 years ago had asked me Are you an anxious person? I would have been like, yeah, it's been crippling since I was a child. But I was unable to see it and acknowledge it because we were kind of told to ignore it. So imagine how much happier we could have been our whole lives. So it is so important that we see it for what it is and then we realized that we need, especially for people who suffer from severe chronic depression is the need for a community of people who know What they're dealing with so ideally, other people with anxious anxiety or depression, who you can go to and be like, Okay, I'm going through this and have that support system because it will decrease our chances of suicide harming ourselves or overeating. You know, just out of eating our feelings. It's a thing. So like with you and I, it's so important that we be open with each other. And I'll just come right out and say it the past couple of days, I went into a really deep, deep, dark depression and Thomas had never seen me like that. I mean, the other night I was crying. I won't even go into why but it wasn't even something huge. That set me off so I can go I guess my temper is like dads. I can go forever and ever and ever things pile up pile up, no reaction, then it just takes one tiny little thing to start knocking over those dominoes. And then I'm mad then it's a raging mad even you know, silently in my head but it's rage and you're

Unknown Speaker : 43:59

weird. Please.

Kelley Richey : 44:01

Yeah, and sadness, depression, it comes in that form for me as well. I've been really happy lately, you know, reading this book, you know, doing a lot of mindfulness and headspace I was I've been really in a peaceful place and probably the most healthy mentally ever. But it just took this one thing to just set it off. And then I started thinking about everything that had been upsetting me lately. And I was crying uncontrollably. And Thomas didn't know where it came from, you know, he doesn't understand that I hell, you know why I'm crying just as much as I do. It's just one of those things where we have to be open to discussing it. And we talked about it.

Unknown Speaker : 44:39

It's not to feel sorry for yourself, because I know that there are those people out there who do consider people who are open about it as people who are seeking attention and that there are people who do seek attention. So that is not 100% incorrect. But for those, you

Kelley Richey : 44:55

know, someone like that

Unknown Speaker : 45:00

That is not apply to everyone and to the majority of people who deal with mental illness do not discount what people are saying, because you assume they're just trying to get attention. It takes a lot to be able to talk about it in the first place. And it's important to talk about it because how can you confront a problem head on without being 100% honest and open about it, and identifying what the issue is, if you're silent about it, and you don't acknowledge it within yourself? You're just gonna be miserable forever. I'm a solution person. I like solution. Yes,

Kelley Richey : 45:34

yes. And I know that my antidepressant medication isn't a isn't a one stop solution. It takes so much more work than that and real mental stretching, but I propose that we leave encouragement to everyone out there who listens that if you deal with anxiety or depression, please feel free to personally message us or use any of the social medias to kind of share your own story and to maybe even create a small community for now in and later that we can kind of encourage each other and really promote some mental well being

Unknown Speaker : 46:11

what I hope that kind of comes out of our podcasts and the platform that we're gonna have. You know, our title is the family ties, for obvious reasons, because we're family. Yes, she's my sister, right. But to take that a step further and extend our platform to become a bigger family to provide a safe place for people who also have issues that they'd either like to address have been dealing with their whole life or maybe have a new issue or have similar issues to those that we have just a safe place to share it with. And if you want to private you can you can just email it to us and let us know not share it, but I really hope that this becomes a helpful platform and tool for people to become a family across the globe and To find solutions to problems to be open to addressing the problems because you can't find a solution until you address the problem and not feel shameful or afraid to speak out about it.

Kelley Richey : 47:13

Yeah, no matter how dark it seems someone else has had something way worse. And that's something I continue to remind myself as people are resilient, but we're even more resilient with support from each other. So let's just create a really good jumping off point for us to like, share each other's friendship and experiences.

Unknown Speaker : 47:36

All right, so I just thought about you know, how in the circus there those girls that use their hair, they're pulled up by their hair and stuff,

Kelley Richey : 47:45

huh? They're insane. Well,

Unknown Speaker : 47:47

yes, that's, that's another mental issue.

Unknown Speaker : 47:55

Getting that is you know, a single hair is very delicate. But when all of your hair is gathered together to do something like that it becomes so much stronger and at some point can pull the weight of a woman you know that kind of thing like you couldn't hold somebody up by one hair but as a gathering all so community Yes Get into Part Two or I

Kelley Richey : 48:18

guess there are so many good fun things and encouraging things coming up in part two hopefully we haven't been too depressing but I think it's really important that we share what we've been through and then hopefully help others Yeah, and then realize that we can be like I can be better like I can get to know my neighbors. I can get to know people on my block and I can make connections and stop feeling sorry for myself. Make a difference. So yeah,

Unknown Speaker : 48:43

not wallow.

Kelley Richey : 48:45

Nice guests. But we love you guys. Please join the family. Julia mentioned our socials but you can say it again. Julie.

Unknown Speaker : 48:55

Say Kelly has worked really hard on I'm Thomas. Thank you so much.

Kelley Richey : 49:00

Thomas You are everything

Unknown Speaker : 49:02

I have vision but website application is not my forte. I know what I want, but like doing it with the website stuff. Hey, that's all Thomas

Kelley Richey : 49:12

Thomas at pixel bruco by the way you look him up.

Unknown Speaker : 49:17

You're hearing that really sweet, huh? And we need to do an about comments on the website. I agree.

Kelley Richey : 49:24

That's cute. Isn't he adorable?

Unknown Speaker : 49:28

You gotta get it. Anyway. Yeah, yeah. Is it our website?

Unknown Speaker : 49:33

Sorry, boys. dot the family ties podcast. Got out. It's a Wednesday. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker : 49:42

Well, guys, it was wonderful spending time with you all and hopefully,

Kelley Richey : 49:46

this has been helpful.

Unknown Speaker : 49:48

All right. We're gonna wrap up.

Unknown Speaker : 49:50

Talk to you guys during Part Two

Unknown Speaker : 49:52

coming up soon. Yeah. Bye bye.